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Post by z3elda on Jun 27, 2015 16:46:35 GMT -5
To all ye brave souls who opened this thread, I say huzzah!
In spite of all the hubbub surrounding the last Dragon hillclimb, it was a great event. We have a new hill record, and a couple of class records were broken. That said, it's clear that the promotion wasn't what it was for past Dragon events.
I am of the opinion that no single person has the time to handle ALL of it. I know I can't.
What I CAN do is share the info within my own specific enthusiast community. I'm a BMW guy, and I'm a regular on several forums and Facebook groups dedicated to that marque. If we can get a few volunteers together who are willing to do the same thing in their enthusiast circles, we can have a big impact. Not a great writer? No worries! Some of us who are can put together some posts that you can copy and paste.
I have talked with a few people already about this, but I'm putting it out there for anyone to join in the effort.
Corvettes, Mazdas, Mustangs, any club or interest group where there might be Drivers, Volunteers or spectators interested in these events.
Please- if you are interested in makimg some posts to help with promoting these events, email me: eric@igaia.com. or catch me on Facebook.
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Post by farrout on Jul 2, 2015 5:43:01 GMT -5
Having been the Race Chair for our Crow Mountain Hill Climb, I can tell you that community relations is extremely important. These small towns can be either supportive or a killer of the event. Their support is necessary as they provide essential services and the spectators. A Region cannot just show up on race weekend - it tends to annoy the town people. Just because a town has been supportive in the past does not mean they will continue to do so as town leadership does change.
As we heard from the County Board Chairman - You want to come into our county, and use our roads for your pleasure. Even though we were bringing a lot of money into an impoverished area, all it took was a few outspoken people to scuttle our event after 7 years. The few detractors far outweighed the many supporters who spoke up in our behalf.
Promotion to potential drivers is important but community relations is equally so.
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Post by Steve Eckerich on Jul 2, 2015 7:56:46 GMT -5
Quick note to drivers as well. Got a call that rooms were all booked at Microtel in Robbinsville. CCR has reserved most of the rooms at the Microtel many months ago to keep them open for our drivers. We will release all but those we need for our staff in the next week. There are other groups that book there so we will be giving drivers a password to get rooms released to them. Look for an email from Vicki and a post here.
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Post by tedebayer on Jul 3, 2015 14:58:51 GMT -5
Well said. We have had 6 sites in last 20 years and now, we have one. Not keeping the site owner happy has contributed to the loss of some of those sites. As Mary, Park Manager at Chimney Rock said "They treated it like a piece of asphalt they owned. It meant a lot more to us as a park." I hope CCR will continue to make a strong effort to bring in tourism. It has to be a mutually beneficial relationship for City, County and Forest Services for us to keep this site and their support. A lot of CCR members worked hard to open that door and new sites are hard to find and harder to open once found. Joyce Kilmer Memorial Forest is not a track we rented and hillclimb is not "just another track event". Thanks Craig. Having been the Race Chair for our Crow Mountain Hill Climb, I can tell you that community relations is extremely important. These small towns can be either supportive or a killer of the event. Their support is necessary as they provide essential services and the spectators. A Region cannot just show up on race weekend - it tends to annoy the town people. Just because a town has been supportive in the past does not mean they will continue to do so as town leadership does change. As we heard from the County Board Chairman - You want to come into our county, and use our roads for your pleasure. Even though we were bringing a lot of money into an impoverished area, all it took was a few outspoken people to scuttle our event after 7 years. The few detractors far outweighed the many supporters who spoke up in our behalf. Promotion to potential drivers is important but community relations is equally so. |
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Post by czrider on Jul 6, 2015 6:31:46 GMT -5
Who are the property owner/owners of a state/federal park/state highway?
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Post by highwayracer on Jul 6, 2015 15:04:42 GMT -5
Having been a member of the Board of Directors for CCR at the time of the last Chimney Rock Hillclimb, I recall the tragic death of a young lady at the park as being much more of a contributing factor to that hillclimb going away than a poor attitude on the part of the club. Having chaired more TT/HC events than I can remember, I agree that it is important to work closely with all of the stakeholders. However, difficult logistics in traffic management, with the main road through town closed 50 minutes of every hour, was the main difficulty at Beech Mountain. The road at Wolf Ridge deteriorated to the point it was unsafe. Eagle's Nest wanted to be compensated an unrealistic amount to continue using the site. Efforts were made at all of these venues to come up with acceptable compromises to no avail. To suggest here or "behind the scenes" and "confidentially" elsewhere that the club is not doing its due diligence in dealing with public officials and site representatives is harmful in and of itself and only serves to promote personal agendas.
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Post by blairunderwood on Jul 15, 2015 8:59:05 GMT -5
Well said Larry!! One person on this thread has done NOTHING but try to go behind the scenes and try to stir the pot with all involved with this segment of our club!! HE was the main reason we have this fine event and almost singularly responsible for its success. THAT SAID, after not getting his way, and having personal issues with the RE, took his marbles and went home!! I thought he had more substance to him than that!! He is doing all he can to have someone do the complaining for him, and hoping for failure!!! THIS CLUB WILL GO ON WITHOUT ANY ONE PERSON!! Feel so sad for this entire situation!!
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Post by z3elda on Jul 15, 2015 12:36:01 GMT -5
Hey Guys- been away from this forum a while. My work laptop, which I use most often, has now been limited so I can't use forums. Ggrrrr. Anyway. Appreciate everyone's comments and concerns here. There is value in all of them. That said, it's time to MOVE ON. We are in the run up to Our August Road Race, closely followed by Dragon 9 (IX). In fact, Dragon registration is opening today (July 15) (EDIT: I'm wrong.. Motorsportsreg says July 22) www.motorsportreg.com/events/chasing-dragon-viii-hillclimb-robbinsville-north-carolina-scca-central-carolinas-806368#.Vaag2WfbLIUI'm hoping everyone reading this will share the info within their own social circles. If everyone does a little, we can keep it growing. |
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Post by farrout on Jul 17, 2015 4:48:06 GMT -5
Dragon posted on the TVR/TAC Website
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Post by jockellis on Jul 19, 2015 17:06:58 GMT -5
What happened to the woman at Chimney Rock?
If we in the Southeast had venues like those in Austria, Germany, Italy, etc., the crowds would speak volumes to the county commissioners or whoever is in charge. We have "bergs" here whereas they have "hills" over there. The European attitude by governments there (not so much in England) allows for climbs in areas that are not only convenient for crowds but also hospitable for them and lucrative for those supplying the hospitality. If Crow Mountain had filled the motels and restaurants to capacity like a stock car race at Daytona or the 12Hours of Sebring then the powers that be wouldn't be listening to the few malcontents.
At Crow we got charged, IIRC, $10 a car as spectators. I don't know what competitors pay but it looked to me like the event could not have brought in more than $100 in gate receipts. Unless Drivers and crews were disguised as 'Bama and Auburn fans Friday night at Western Sizzlin' then there were not many folks dining out there.
While I've lamented the lack of spectator vantage points in the past, I'm in awe that there is actually a road cut through that inhospitable mountainside. Building stairs, cutting paths and constructing safe, PE-approved viewing areas would probably not be economically feasible. Sort of stuck between a rock and a hard place, so to speak.
The most enjoyable part of both Crow and the Dragon for me was talking with other fans. It would appear that the best way to foster that spirit of cohesiveness would be to do as much as possible in town and try to involve county officials, if possible.
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Post by Steve Eckerich on Jul 20, 2015 11:51:59 GMT -5
Dragon is in a National Forest that is "Zero Maintenance" and we are not allowed to clear for spectators. We offered to clear new areas many times at our expense. Not an option. Sucks because it would be a much bigger draw to spectators if we could. Blowing the road off this past event made it much more driver friendly, and we are looking at more options for the September race. Just clearing what we have for parking is about the limit they will allow. We work with what we have and keep looking for ways to make it better. We had fun in June, and look forward to more fun in September. Thanks to everyone that is posting on facebook and other venues to help promote our hillclimb,.
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Post by farrout on Jul 22, 2015 12:42:06 GMT -5
What happened to the woman at Chimney Rock? If we in the Southeast had venues like those in Austria, Germany, Italy, etc., the crowds would speak volumes to the county commissioners or whoever is in charge. We have "bergs" here whereas they have "hills" over there. The European attitude by governments there (not so much in England) allows for climbs in areas that are not only convenient for crowds but also hospitable for them and lucrative for those supplying the hospitality. If Crow Mountain had filled the motels and restaurants to capacity like a stock car race at Daytona or the 12Hours of Sebring then the powers that be wouldn't be listening to the few malcontents. At Crow we got charged, IIRC, $10 a car as spectators. I don't know what competitors pay but it looked to me like the event could not have brought in more than $100 in gate receipts. Unless Drivers and crews were disguised as 'Bama and Auburn fans Friday night at Western Sizzlin' then there were not many folks dining out there. While I've lamented the lack of spectator vantage points in the past, I'm in awe that there is actually a road cut through that inhospitable mountainside. Building stairs, cutting paths and constructing safe, PE-approved viewing areas would probably not be economically feasible. Sort of stuck between a rock and a hard place, so to speak. The most enjoyable part of both Crow and the Dragon for me was talking with other fans. It would appear that the best way to foster that spirit of cohesiveness would be to do as much as possible in town and try to involve county officials, if possible. According to the Jackson County Tourism Chair, Crow Mtn brought in >$325,000 to the community each year. This fact did not sway the then County Board who had already decided to terminate the event. Spectators started dying out when Scottsboro decided that they could no longer provide the busses we used to transport spectators up the hill nor could we rent them. The real issue for us safety types is that the roadway became unsafe to run due to the damage inflicted by the logging trucks. In the last year, I had to choke down the road to less than a SOLO gate width in a 100 mph section to keep drivers out of the stuff that would send them down the hill side. We had the County Road Engineer out there to provide an estimate and validate the necessary repairs. The estimate fell under their minimum level to do. We offered to pay for or have the repairs done by our contractors. Jackson County has a binding contract that dictated that we could not do that. Couple this with the fact that entries had decreased to 27 per year in the last 4 years of the event. We had many drivers compete once and say they would not drive the hill again. Yes, it was difficult, technical, and any mistake cost you big time. If you have never been the Chairman for a Hill Climb, then you do not understand the significant amount of time necessary to do it right. Support your Regions and your Race Chairs by offering to help - not just on the weekend of the event but for the 9 months before it. Without these Race Chairs donating their time and energy, we would not have anywhere to race. My hat is off to them all. Thank you for all you do. |
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Post by highwayracer on Jul 22, 2015 13:11:02 GMT -5
Craig is correct. A lot of work goes into organizing these events, and most of the time it is circumstances beyond our control that end them.
A few years ago I was in Beech Mountain and ran into one of the locals who helped us get the hillclimb there going 16 years ago. He remains interested in the hillclimb, and would like it to return, but says the political environment is not conducive right now. He went on to explain that since Beech Mountain is a resort town, the number of permanent residents is quite low, and the number of registered voters even lower. If you own a vacation home in Beech Mountain, you can either register to vote there or in your hometown, but not both. He went on to tell me there were fewer than 100 registered voters in Beech Mountain, and most of them are retirees. A bunch of sportscars running up a mountain and tying up the main road through town is not their idea of a peaceful retirement, and they could care less how much revenue we bring to the town. Add to that the fact that eligible candidates for office come from this same pool of voters, and you can easily see that it can be hard to manage. Just a few votes can get the pro hillclimb members of the board out of office.
At The Dragon, Ted did a great job of interacting with the community and keeping all of the stakeholders happy. I'm sorry that he decided to walk away from the event and CCR, but he had to do what he decided was best for himself. Those of us who enjoy hillclimbing and The Dragon have to pick up and carry on. We all need to do what we can to promote the event, patronize local businesses and let them know we appreciate them when we are in town.
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Post by naro914 on Jul 27, 2015 11:29:53 GMT -5
As a long time member, regional President, then National Staff member of PCA, plus having chaired just about every type of event PCA holds, I can attest first hand how difficult it is to run events with the magnitude of a Hillclimb. Events like this take a lot more effort than just the operations of the activity itself, many times it takes awareness and negotiations of the surrounding environment. Try holding a car clubs National Convention for over 2000 attendees that spans a full week in Downtown Charlotte, where we closed ALL the roads in the center of town for a full day for a car show!!
If we want ANY event to succeed, there needs to be a collective effort from region staff, event chairs, volunteers AND participants to do everything possible to promote and help in any way we can. One person cannot do it alone, but everyone need to work together toward the common good...everyone needs to row the boat in the same direction!
That said, I do not see why finger pointing and accusations need to be brought into a forum thread that asked a simple request: Can everyone help promote the Dragon Hillclimb? Seriously??? Can't we all just get along?
Ted is THE NUMBER ONE REASON that my wife and I started attending the Dragon hillclimb and thus joining SCCA. His patience and willingness to do whatever it took to help newbies like us into this Hillclimb and SCCA world is what got us excited in the first place and what has kept us coming back. And I can guarantee you, there are MANY that will tell you the exact same thing.
Things change, move on. It doesn't matter why, they just do. Learn from the past, build on the successes and make things even better going forward.
As a very wise man once told me "When is ceases to be fun, it ceases to be"...
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Post by Steve Eckerich on Jul 28, 2015 6:26:36 GMT -5
Good post Bob. In the end we all want the same thing, to play with cars and have fun. We would all admit we come to events as much for the friends we have made along the way as we do for the racing. It is more like a family reunion than we think. As with all family there will be disagreements but we all can look past that and do our best for the region and the event. Thanks for the reminder. Registration is open so lets make this the biggest Dragon ever, meet some new friends, and set some new records. www.motorsportreg.com/events/chasing-dragon-viii-hillclimb-robbinsville-north-carolina-scca-central-carolinas-806368 |
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Post by jockellis on Aug 16, 2015 23:14:48 GMT -5
So what happened to the woman at Chimney Rock?
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Post by tedebayer on Aug 17, 2015 7:07:47 GMT -5
news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1876&dat=19940821&id=FTIfAAAAIBAJ&sjid=Ks8EAAAAIBAJ&pg=6850,1611473&hl=en on Page 9 Jock, the death of the child was in August of 1994 was not related to the hillclimb. (See article) Unfortunately, another child died from a fall in 2008 but again, park was found not to be negligent. Mary Jaeger Gayle is the Park Manager now and was a Manager during all of the 90s during those hillclimbs. Contact her if you would like to hear from the source. A total of 1,025 people died in national parks from 2007 to 2013.
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Post by jockellis on Oct 13, 2015 15:44:42 GMT -5
Thanks for the link. That was the coolest website I've ever seen for a paper. Sounds like they just used the death as an excuse.
Sure wish Georgia would allow roads to be used for competition.
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