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Post by tedebayer on Oct 23, 2012 22:24:16 GMT -5
I agree with James. If you look at the trophies as "dust collectors" ...chances are, you already have a bunch because you are a veteran solo driver. That makes you a minority. Statistics show that southeastern regions lose 25% of their solo drivers per year.... that means every 4 years, we lose the majority. We need to keep those experienced drivers and improve our retention rate.
So..what attracts and keeps new people? Personally, I think the trophies are key in that. It's a physical manifestation of a success in a competition based on skills. The newer driver wins one and goes to work Monday.. asks his fellow worker, "what did you do this weekend?" He listens about Bobby catching a fish, Jane bowled 210, he painted his birdbath and irrigated the lawn. Then our driver smiles, holds up his trophy, and says "I ran a solo and I won! " He shares it with family and friends... and maybe, we get some of them to come give it a try. (Yes... trophies are a recruiting tool as well as a sponsor enticement. )It sits on his desk or on his mantle and while he seldom looks at it, his subconscious does... and it reminds him of a positive experience ... and he wants to repeat it. If you are a lady running in a men's class, you will be VERY proud of that first trophy when it comes...and it will!
I've seen regions that did away with trophies and saw attendance drop over the year. Looking at other regions in other parts of US... the larger more successful ones do still have trophies. Some have ONE for PRO class and winner gets to take it home until next event. End of year... the one who won it most gets to keep it.
I am all for saving costs but we make more money with more new drivers than we do by reducing a few dollars from trophy expenses. Trophies are not that expensive and the feel good they give drivers are worth the expense in my opinion. But I also agree with James, the trophy presentation means a lot more when there is people you drove with there to clap when you accept it. I would ask everyone PLEASE state your opinions and share ideas. THAT is where the best decision will be found... but remember who we need to attract and who we need to keep that we are losing now. If you have some ideas on improving retention... please email me, James or one of the Board members. We want our club to continue to grow strong... and part of that is keeping it fun and interesting to all drivers in all disciplines. People have a choice with what they do with their time... we want them here with us!
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Post by srduck on Oct 24, 2012 5:19:26 GMT -5
O.K. , i am still not in the best of moods to post on this topic , but here goes: i have been around a while, and scored a few trophys. Some were ho-hum. But some meant a great deal to me. Not in size or style, but in memories. Holding off a close competitor, Beating someone the first time. Any of a number of reasons. But the thing i liked best was everyone hanging out for the presentation. Then groups (or class competitors) going for dinner as a group. I'm gonna stop right here.... this is the important bit. Casino has been urging us this year to go out for dinner as a group more often. Triad does it after every single event.... big group goes out for dinner (usually Mexican). We've tried getting groups up this year, but it's usually just me, AJ, Licursi, and Casino packing up and then going out for dinner afterwards. Even with trophies and raffle drawings and all that crap... I think all of us that went to NCAC will remember just hanging out at dinner more than anything else that weekend. Trophies or not, we need to do that more often! |
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Post by ball80 on Oct 24, 2012 9:13:43 GMT -5
Duck, when I was in town I'd go to fox and the hound with y'all.
And about this trophy thing, the last zmax. There was total of I think 20 people there waiting.after we cleaned up, and more than half were regulars.
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Post by z3elda on Oct 24, 2012 9:19:04 GMT -5
O.K. , i am still not in the best of moods to post on this topic , but here goes: i have been around a while, and scored a few trophys. Some were ho-hum. But some meant a great deal to me. Not in size or style, but in memories. Holding off a close competitor, Beating someone the first time. Any of a number of reasons. But the thing i liked best was everyone hanging out for the presentation. Then groups (or class competitors) going for dinner as a group. I'm gonna stop right here.... this is the important bit. Casino has been urging us this year to go out for dinner as a group more often. Triad does it after every single event.... big group goes out for dinner (usually Mexican). We've tried getting groups up this year, but it's usually just me, AJ, Licursi, and Casino packing up and then going out for dinner afterwards. Even with trophies and raffle drawings and all that crap... I think all of us that went to NCAC will remember just hanging out at dinner more than anything else that weekend. Trophies or not, we need to do that more often! I say all the time.. SOLO is a Social event masquerading as a Motorports event. Both pieces of the equation are important. James and I have talked a little about retention. We're doing better than most here in CCR, but as Ted points out, it's a constant thing we need to be attentive to. |
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Post by soloracer on Oct 24, 2012 21:18:27 GMT -5
An idea just came to mind. Super solos. But the big difference is we (with Ted's permission ) pick three events and use the winner's circle. Complete with a trophy QUEEN. Say one each at Z-max, Metrolina, and Knights. Make a cordial invite to gather at *** for dinner after the event at the drivers' meeting.
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Post by integra55 on Oct 25, 2012 4:16:45 GMT -5
James, any and all of these ideas are great for those that live within ... say ... an hr of the event ... but 2 1/2 - 3 hrs away  I usually don't stay for my trophy, no matter what .. if closer I'd be glad to work the clean up ... used to do it up here quite often ... just the drive puts me way too late getting home so while the put down for those that don't stay to help is valid in some/many/most cases .. keep in mind that everyones situation is unique |
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Post by soloracer on Oct 25, 2012 21:13:31 GMT -5
James, any and all of these ideas are great for those that live within ... say ... an hr of the event ... but 2 1/2 - 3 hrs away I usually don't stay for my trophy, no matter what .. if closer I'd be glad to work the clean up ... used to do it up here quite often ... just the drive puts me way too late getting home so while the put down for those that don't stay to help is valid in some/many/most cases .. keep in mind that everyones situation is unique Walter, it is always good to see you. In an earlier post i stated "i understand". Life happens,and no one is going to be upset at People with long drives. I have run events as far away as Roanoke Va. and loaded up as soon as my runs and work were finished. I realise some people may need to leave ASAP to go to work, meet other obligations. Just saying, if you can, stick around for the "winners' circle". |
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DaGou
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Post by DaGou on Oct 29, 2012 13:31:05 GMT -5
Some one already said this but Trophies? I am a novice and have been to like 5 events this year and really did not know that they existed. I saw it on the posted times, like 5 entires, and 1 trophy, but I have never seen a trophy or heard of any one novice or veteran ever even mention a trophy. True I never hung around to the bitter end but I never knew anything happened beside packing up. I do my work assignments and try to help out during the day where I can. You are stupid if you had not noticed there is a core group of people who run these events and do ten times the work of a standard work assignment. They work days and nights before and after the events. This makes them all a pretty tight group. I am sure after the event they might go out for a beer and a bite. Who am I to hang around and be a groupie and try to get in with the "in crowd". I did not do it in high school and I am not doing to some 30 years later. Would I like to join them? Yes I would love to get to know them better and get to know the guys I drive with better too.
I never like to bitch without having at least a partial solution:
1) If there really are trophies hold one up at the safety meeting and let people see it. "This is the trophy you could win today."
2) Tell people that the trophies will be awarded after we all clean up.
3) If you want a bunch of people to go out afterward, say that too! "Tonight we are meeting at place XYZ following the awards."
I would like to buy the trophy winner in my class a beer or one for the many men and women at the club who have helped me out.
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Post by srduck on Oct 29, 2012 16:17:20 GMT -5
You are stupid if you had not noticed there is a core group of people who run these events and do ten times the work of a standard work assignment. They work days and nights before and after the events. This makes them all a pretty tight group. I am sure after the event they might go out for a beer and a bite. Who am I to hang around and be a groupie and try to get in with the "in crowd". I did not do it in high school and I am not doing to some 30 years later. Would I like to join them? Yes I would love to get to know them better and get to know the guys I drive with better too. Holy crap... we have groupies!??!  A) how do I get one and B) how do I prevent my wife from knowing?!?! As for core workers, the way we got to be a core was just jumping in and helping where it needed to be done. We do the less pretty jobs that start early and run late and cause massive headaches from time to time, and we would gladly welcome you to join in and do the same if you have an affinity for early mornings and coffee/energy drinks and or a high tolerance for headaches!  I know for a fact we STILL need some more registration people, as we had to recruit Kelly from SCR to help out my wife at the event yesterday, and having someone else to help Travis with worker assignment/check-in/etc would be greatly appreciated, I'm sure. I can't speak to the trophy thing, but I will go ahead and say this. After the event at zMax on November 10th, we WILL be going out for dinner afterwards. I don't know where, but there are many good choices around the Concord area. Everyone is invited and it is now public knowledge. There is now NO excuse for missing it  And ask anyone that went to NCAC with us.... we're a pretty funny group to have dinner and a beer with The dinner thing has been Casino's crusade this year. If you've ever run with Triad Sports Car Club, you know they ALWAYS go out to dinner as a group after events. Usually it's Mexican but sometimes they break the mold and do something different. It's part of the reason they're all such a tight-knit club, and we need to have that with CCR. It's not some "cool kids club" where nobody else is invited to participate, it's just that by the time we've decided on where to go, everyone else has left. Maybe we need to have a "dinner steward" to announce it in the morning, organize everything through the day, and get to the restaurant to get us a table while we're packing the trailer? Any takers?! |
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Post by ball80 on Oct 29, 2012 17:08:40 GMT -5
I vote quaker steak and lube. Close by. I can see if they will make a big long table if everyone is in agreement.
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Post by cr89x on Oct 29, 2012 19:25:23 GMT -5
Thank you for recognizing the hard work that our HIGHLY dedicated members do put forth. Most people have no idea. Just because I'm walking around in the morning with a cup of coffee in hand, doesn't mean that I haven't done a crap load of work for a long time before the event. Nor does it mean there aren't five others aren't working hard setting up something. I am very greatful to have these people helping out the club as much as they do. I have felt WAY less stressed at an event and absolutely enjoying myself.  Thank you all! Trophies have always been done at the very end of the event as the trailer is almost loaded. If this isn't known, people are coming out to abuse their cars and leave asap. Motorsports is really nothing more than a social gathering. *My drinking team has a racing problem.* This weekend we had a couple of new faces at our dinners, and they were very much welcomed in. I know they had a great time and are looking forward to chilling with the CRAZIES, not the cool kids, again. With that, I will quote my mother. "We put the FUN in dysfunctional." |
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Post by Donutz on Oct 29, 2012 20:45:07 GMT -5
You are stupid if you had not noticed there is a core group of people who run these events and do ten times the work of a standard work assignment. They work days and nights before and after the events. This makes them all a pretty tight group. .........Would I like to join them? Yes I would love to get to know them better I'm making a point to come find you at zMax and shake your hand for this... and of course get to know you better but the win that was achieved with this post was very enlightening. This is the feedback we need. Danke (side note no I'm not German...feel like that is necessary information to include since I just said I'm gonna hunt you down at zMax lol) |
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Post by z3elda on Oct 29, 2012 22:15:50 GMT -5
Great feedback Dagou - I think I'll help AJ out and laminate him a "Cheat Sheet" to use at drivers meetings. There are several things we should repeat every time, because we always have new faces in the crowd.
Regarding the core workers: You've pretty well hit the nail on the head. We've become tight-Knit because we're together alot working on something we love. There's no secret handshake or magic formula, and we're not all 20 year veterans of the club. Some of us are quite new. We just just saw a need or had ability.
Regarding Dinner: The whole point of getting together after an event is to get to know each other better and build camraderie within the club. EVERYBODY IS ALWAYS INVITED TO THIS! But we also know that many people need to head home, and that is fine. I can't always attend either. We also have social events every month- again, these are for everybody!
There's also an informal group of people that travel to race with neighboring clubs and regions. People from these clubs help support our events all the time, and I personally believe its only fair to support these clubs' events. It's also a great way to get more seat time and meet some awesome people while competing with some great drivers. Again - we usually post up caravans heading to these events, and everybody is welcome to go!
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Post by soloracer on Oct 30, 2012 21:40:38 GMT -5
WOW, just WOW. This thread may become one of the most important ever seen on this forum. i spend a lot of time wandering the paddock asking what would make events better. ( Cassino another lame reason i do not compete lately) This thread has many fine points. i humbly suggest in all future event posts we include a picture of the trophy. At the drivers meeting we (someone ) hold up a trophy or two. Then we ANNOUNCE where we will gather after the event. Anyone who has to leave early (i'm guilty) can designate a trophy "guardian" to receive their award.
To Dagau, thank you for the valuable insight. In high school, i did not belong to the "in crowd" , i was too busy with the local sports car club. (long story)
If you think the Core Group is an "in crowd" you are mistaken ,and i apologise for that. The core just wants events to work flawlessly, or as best as we can. You are more than welcome to join in. My only proof of this is that i never capitialise the letter i in my posts, as i am just another club member. i am sure aj , mike, travis ,travis, john, steve, amy , andy and others feel the same way. We are just club members.
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Post by soloracer on Oct 30, 2012 21:48:43 GMT -5
I would like to buy the trophy winner in my class a beer or one for the many men and women at the club who have helped me out. i am sure if you continue with us, someone in your class will buy you a beer, as a winner. In the meantime , show up at our next social and i will buy you your first beer for your great feedback. Or after our next autocross. Look me up , the guy in the stetson, looking lost. |
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Post by soloracer on Oct 30, 2012 21:58:35 GMT -5
I vote quaker steak and lube. Close by. I can see if they will make a big long table if everyone is in agreement. The dinner steward. |
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Post by ball80 on Oct 30, 2012 22:13:00 GMT -5
I vote quaker steak and lube. Close by. I can see if they will make a big long table if everyone is in agreement. The dinner steward. I am but the assistant to the dinner steward. Mr James Farris is the dinner steward! |
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Post by CoolGuy094 on Oct 30, 2012 22:35:10 GMT -5
DaGou I'll buy you a beer any day, S2000 owners stick together! Plus now I owe you for letting me drive your car and giving me free car parts!!! Also I still need to win you over to swap side markers with me.
All your comments were well put and humbly accepted, Wally. I wish you could make it to more events. And i like the "cheat sheet" idea, Eric. Its so easy to skip or forget little topics like trophies when everyone just wants to hear run groups and get racing!
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Post by Frodo on Oct 30, 2012 23:46:56 GMT -5
*tears* someone looks up to me and I'm short  |
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Post by cr89x on Oct 31, 2012 5:27:04 GMT -5
I was very scattered brained this weekend with driver meetings. I was busy thinking of the rest of the day. I've been telling myself to make a "cheat sheet" for months. I like how Hodges driver meetings are virtually identical every event they host. Some may have noticed that I've been doing driver meetings with hand written notes the past few months. Perhaps I'm getting old and forgetful |
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Post by toilets on Oct 31, 2012 10:20:36 GMT -5
Trophies are cool, plain and simple. I cannot tell you how excited I was bringing home a 1st place plaque to show my wife for the first time, even if there was only 1 other car in my class. A win is a win. Not only was she happy for me, it also made her justify the fact that I dropped a pretty coin for my car. I think her exact words were at-least you are using it for what the factory designed it for.
In regards to next year, heck, I even pay 5 dollars extra per event to get a new version trophy. Bottom line, I vote to keep trophies, not stickers, and if possible maybe something different. LOL, to be honest, I was hoping for a third place finish one event so I could get one of those old school wheel trophies.
For the in-crowd perspective, I think we need to do it like AJ did this last event and announce to all that we are going out after the event to X place. That way everyone knows beforehand what/when/where this is going to happen. Id surely like to attend if my time allows.
Now, I am unfamiliar with how the SCCA operates so don’t bite my head off please. I see a lot of mentioning about the hard work to set up these events and the clean-up part after these events. But isn’t that what the entry fee the drivers pay for? To help incur the cost of this? I know it helps pay for the grounds, insurance, some kind of dues to SCCA I am sure, overall operating costs etc., but doesn’t the setting up and cleaning up fall under the operating costs (IE paying the people who set up/clean-up for their time)? If not direct compensation because of the whole non-profit thing but surely free events or discount on events or something. I would surely hope AJ, Mike, Amy etc. are getting some kind of compensation/benefit for all their hard work?
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Post by srduck on Oct 31, 2012 11:54:16 GMT -5
Now, I am unfamiliar with how the SCCA operates so don’t bite my head off please. I see a lot of mentioning about the hard work to set up these events and the clean-up part after these events. But isn’t that what the entry fee the drivers pay for? To help incur the cost of this? I know it helps pay for the grounds, insurance, some kind of dues to SCCA I am sure, overall operating costs etc., but doesn’t the setting up and cleaning up fall under the operating costs (IE paying the people who set up/clean-up for their time)? If not direct compensation because of the whole non-profit thing but surely free events or discount on events or something. I would surely hope AJ, Mike, Amy etc. are getting some kind of compensation/benefit for all their hard work? In road racing, where you pay ridiculously high entry fees, that's how it works. You're paying other people to do work for you. But with AutoX, we're a volunteer organization. EVERYONE has to work. For some people they do their work assignment and just say "Okay I'm done"... but it's always greatly appreciated when people will pitch in and lend a hand with whatever it is has to be done. I certainly wouldn't mind all the work if we jack entry fees for the "drive, pack up, go home" crowd to $275 or so like a road race and put some of that in my pocket! |
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Post by toilets on Oct 31, 2012 12:40:36 GMT -5
Now, I am unfamiliar with how the SCCA operates so don’t bite my head off please. I see a lot of mentioning about the hard work to set up these events and the clean-up part after these events. But isn’t that what the entry fee the drivers pay for? To help incur the cost of this? I know it helps pay for the grounds, insurance, some kind of dues to SCCA I am sure, overall operating costs etc., but doesn’t the setting up and cleaning up fall under the operating costs (IE paying the people who set up/clean-up for their time)? If not direct compensation because of the whole non-profit thing but surely free events or discount on events or something. I would surely hope AJ, Mike, Amy etc. are getting some kind of compensation/benefit for all their hard work? In road racing, where you pay ridiculously high entry fees, that's how it works. You're paying other people to do work for you. But with AutoX, we're a volunteer organization. EVERYONE has to work. For some people they do their work assignment and just say "Okay I'm done"... but it's always greatly appreciated when people will pitch in and lend a hand with whatever it is has to be done. I certainly wouldn't mind all the work if we jack entry fees for the "drive, pack up, go home" crowd to $275 or so like a road race and put some of that in my pocket! If that's the case then I will try and help out more when I can. |
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Post by Steve Eckerich on Oct 31, 2012 12:43:35 GMT -5
What Steven posted is partially true. All of the workers at a Road Race are volunteers just like at an AX. The difference is they are not competing (said with teeth firmly clenched) and we cover their motel room or provide some gas money to help offset cost. Many have driven over 300 miles to work and will be there for 3 days. They are not paid any more than the AX workers are.
It is true the fees are much higher so the "DRIVERS" do not have to work. This extra money, if we make a profit, is used to buy all this great equipment we use for all the clubs programs. This is where the club aspect comes in. We all give our time to earn money for the club so we can afford nice equipment and we all benefit from the sacrifice of the volunteers.
For information cleanup and packing at the races is no different than an AX. The workers go home and the core group stays and loads the trailer, packs up timing, and makes sure everything is clean for the site owner. I left CMS at 8:00 sunday night and the guard just had me lock the gate as I left.
Next event I suggest you go thank the "core group" that is working so hard to keep your entry fee as low as it is now, without them you would be paying much more. ;D
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Post by tedebayer on Oct 31, 2012 13:13:03 GMT -5
Thanks for making that clear Steve... I don't want anyone in our region thinking road racers are paying for work to be done for them. No one working at a road race is making money but our region... and the entire region benefits with the profits from road races which pays for timing equipment, trucks, trailers, maintenance/tires, pylons, site rentals, etc. ... things that road racers, solo drivers and time trial drivers all enjoy.
Road racing is making substantially more money for our region than any of our disciplines... our workers for road races come from solo and hillclimbers in our region and workers from OTHER regions who enjoy being a part... and there is a pool of people who come and work that do not participate in any discipline. They just enjoy being a part of road racing... some of those do not even wish to be compensated. On the other hand, some of the people that are working to make the event happen are also driving in the events... they pay FULL entry fee and then spend half of their race weekend working to make the event run smoothly for everyone. Steve and Vicki are good examples of that.
Road race, Solo, Time Trial... all of us in SCCA and CCR are in a volunteer organization and we all work together so we can all compete and have fun and pursue our passion.
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Post by srduck on Oct 31, 2012 14:16:10 GMT -5
I didn't mean for it to sound the way I guess it came off. Yes, EVERYTHING about the SCCA is a volunteer organization. It's just that at an AutoX, competitors don't get the luxury of lounging around after their group is done because there are dedicated course workers out there.... it's all hands on deck, and extra help is ALWAYS appreciated. I say it that way because we have had, on occasion, road race guys show up to AutoX events and just not do ANYTHING. They make their runs, skip out on their work assignments, and go home. Road race/TT guys don't have to trudge out on course to flag when it's not their group running, or go up a mountain and sweep corners.... they don't have to work tech or timing or grid or safety stewards... and part of the money they pay does go towards some of the things that help recruit workers to come out and volunteer like the hotel rooms, gas money, worker gifts, Saturday night socials, etc.
And there was actually a conversation on another forum (Steve, you may have read it) about "Pay someone to work for me" AutoX entry fees. They were toying with the concept of having a $100 or so entry fee (normally $40 or so) for anyone that wanted to sort of "opt out" of working at an event. The club would then recruit comeptitors willing to work an extra session, pay them from that, and call it a day. A lot of the discussion was on the "pain point" at which reasonable people would still opt to work instead of paying others to do it for them.
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Post by tedebayer on Oct 31, 2012 15:48:58 GMT -5
Speaking for myself here... Thanks for re-stating that Steven because it did come off wrong. That is some strong comments you are making there about a great group of people that are part of OUR club. If you can supply me with some names of road racers that did that, I'd like to follow up on that. If you can't or it was what you heard, then... that is not grounded in fact. Were those road racers that ran and left CCR members? SCCA members? How do we know they were road racers? Please email the names and events and I will be glad to follow up. Those individuals need to know what they did and what affect it had on some members of our club. It was rude. If in fact it was a family emergency or medical problem, I think we assumed the worst incorrectly. Not really fair and not fair to say "road racers" in comments about what a few did.
I think making remarks about "road racers" stereo-typically is not a good move and contributes to "them and us" attitude that some have and can damage relationships inside our club. CCR is not an autocross club... nor is it a road race club...nor is it a Hillclimber club. We are all part of SCCA. All of us contribute and our road racing program financially makes a lot of what we ALL enjoy possible. I don't road race but when I work a race, I am not working for the road racing program...I am working for our club and supporting it's actiivities. I'm helping CCR.
If you will think about it... far more autocrossers have shown up, taken their runs and left without working than there have been road racers that ran and left. This is a fair statement as recently several people have complained because no road racers come and run autocross. If I understand correctly, ANYONE who shows up and runs without working is required to work several events without running or they are banned from running. WHO EVER you are. So any one who does it... won't be doing it twice.
CCR is number 1# in Large SCCA regions again this month in membership / retention measurements (see Sportscar Magazine). We have solid programs and are financially strong. In every strong region in the large category, you will find a successful solo and a successful road race program. That 'working together as a team' makes it succeed.
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Post by Steve Eckerich on Oct 31, 2012 16:42:51 GMT -5
One other reason AX is so important to SCCA and to CCR in general is that it is the main pathway to new members. Road Racing is great, but AX is usually the "face of the club" and the first contact most new people have with SCCA. Hillclimb is a close second with the spectators, but we do way more AX events per year. The first impression is important and the core group, and everyone involved in the AX program should be very proud of the member numbers for CCR. It means people are having fun and feel welcome. I still have my first ax award, the "ronnie redline trophy" that is a hunk of wood with a bent valve sticking out. I will not admit how I won it. Great ideas in this thread about next year. Everyone should consider contacting AJ and Mike to pick one event next year to shadow them and really learn what is involved in putting on an AX. I am sure they could use the help. |
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Post by srduck on Oct 31, 2012 17:08:57 GMT -5
I still have my first ax award, the "ronnie redline trophy" that is a hunk of wood with a bent valve sticking out. I will not admit how I won it. Valves? I didn't know you knew what those are!! |
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Post by toilets on Oct 31, 2012 17:33:00 GMT -5
So who is up for a beer after zmax? |
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I usually don't stay for my trophy, no matter what .. if closer I'd be glad to work the clean up ... used to do it up here quite often ... just the drive puts me way too late getting home 
I know for a fact we STILL need some more registration people, as we had to recruit Kelly from SCR to help out my wife at the event yesterday, and having someone else to help Travis with worker assignment/check-in/etc would be greatly appreciated, I'm sure. 
And ask anyone that went to NCAC with us.... we're a pretty funny group to have dinner and a beer with 
Thank you all! 
